hhisc29926
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:51 am

I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:08 pm

Hello!, thank you for reading my thread/post/inquiry. I have a Sega Genesis game that can not be played with Kega Fusion (so, please do not suggest me to use it), and have read that it can be played with M.E.S.S.. It happens that M.E.S.S. is now combined with M.A.M.E., then I downloaded M.A.M.E. 0.188 (the latest version) 64-bit for Windows from MAMEDEV.org.. I can play arcade games with that, but do not know how to play N.E.S. or Genesis games on it, I put some R.O.M.s in the "roms" folder of MAME, then what should I do now? (I can only see the arcade games on the emulator once I start it, not the N.E.S. nor Genesis R.O.M.s). I have researched the internet for many hours, and all I find is complicated stuff full with strange (weird) technical words and instructions that I do not understand, as I am not a developer, nor a programmer nor something like that, and that does not help me at all. I will appreciate if someone is kind enough to explain me in a clear, understandable way what to do without writing such comments as "Google it!" or "You should now that" (if I knew it I would not be posting my question). Thank you very much for your comprehension and help.

mhoes
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:26 pm

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:12 pm

Hi,

Sorry I cannot help you, but others might be (better able to), if you could tell what the exact Sega Genesis game is that you are trying to get to work.

hhisc29926
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:51 am

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:33 pm

Hello!.

The game that is causing me trouble is "Pier Solar and the Great Architects" (that is the one which originated this whole situation). The game can not be played on Kega Fusion nor Gens (I have them installed and they did not run the game, even after lots of tweaking, and I have also read that it can not be played on either of those emulators, anyway). I installed Retroarch also, but do not know how to make it run that game (in the case that it will be able to do it) or any other game . There is very little information on the internet about Retroarch (other than very technical and weird information), and I do not even know if Retroarch is an emulator itself or if it is an emulator manager. I have read on different sites that the game can be played with M.E.S.S. (which is now combined with M.A.M.E.), but do not know how to make M.E.S.S. (I have a former version) nor M.A.M.E. (which now includes M.E.S.S.) run it. I have read also that none of the latest versions of M.E.S.S. or M.A.M.E. need B.I.O.S. for N.E.S. nor Genesis.

I still would like to use M.A.M.E. with N.E.S. and Genesis games, but all the information I have found during many hours and days of researching is too complicated. The people who post that information either want to brag about their knowledge, or post it just to their fellow developers/programmers, or do not have the knowledge for typing the information in easy and understandable terms (or perhaps a combination of those cases). I think (and can be sure about it) that there are thousands (or perhaps millions) of people around the world that would like to use such emultators, but because the information about them is presented in such a complicated way, the big mayority of the people can not use and enjoy such good programs. It is my hope that I will find someone nice enough as to explain me how to use M.A.M.E. (or at least M.E.S.S.) with console games, or at least to direct me to a site made for the average person, so that I will understand the instructions.

Thank you very much for all your help.

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Tafoid
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Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Wed Aug 02, 2017 6:56 pm

hhisc29926 wrote:
Wed Aug 02, 2017 4:33 pm
Hello!.

The game that is causing me trouble is "Pier Solar and the Great Architects" (that is the one which originated this whole situation). The game can not be played on Kega Fusion nor Gens (I have them installed and they did not run the game, even after lots of tweaking, and I have also read that it can not be played on either of those emulators, anyway). I installed Retroarch also, but do not know how to make it run that game (in the case that it will be able to do it) or any other game . There is very little information on the internet about Retroarch (other than very technical and weird information), and I do not even know if Retroarch is an emulator itself or if it is an emulator manager. I have read on different sites that the game can be played with M.E.S.S. (which is now combined with M.A.M.E.), but do not know how to make M.E.S.S. (I have a former version) nor M.A.M.E. (which now includes M.E.S.S.) run it. I have read also that none of the latest versions of M.E.S.S. or M.A.M.E. need B.I.O.S. for N.E.S. nor Genesis.

I still would like to use M.A.M.E. with N.E.S. and Genesis games, but all the information I have found during many hours and days of researching is too complicated. The people who post that information either want to brag about their knowledge, or post it just to their fellow developers/programmers, or do not have the knowledge for typing the information in easy and understandable terms (or perhaps a combination of those cases). I think (and can be sure about it) that there are thousands (or perhaps millions) of people around the world that would like to use such emultators, but because the information about them is presented in such a complicated way, the big mayority of the people can not use and enjoy such good programs. It is my hope that I will find someone nice enough as to explain me how to use M.A.M.E. (or at least M.E.S.S.) with console games, or at least to direct me to a site made for the average person, so that I will understand the instructions.

Thank you very much for all your help.

Rather than getting too deep on softlists and hash files and all that, I'll try to make it as simple as possible for you to run your game.
If you are not familiar with the command window (looks like the old DOS screens with a prompt), then navigate to just above the folder where your MAME resides and hold SHIFT+Right Click, In the list of options, you get an "Open command window here" or similar message (I'm describing from Windows 7 install). Once you have a command window showing the same folder location as your MAME executable, type the following (dependant, of course, on MAME version downloaded):

mame genesis -cart path/to/game/to/play.now
An example of this which works on my system is:
mame64 genesis -cart D:\software\megadriv\psolar.zip

path/to/game/to/play.now represents the path to the game you want to play, simply. You can easily do this by navigating with Windows to the folder what has your game you want to run and "DRAG (select and hold left mouse button) and then move the icon to the command window. What is pasted when you do that is the location of the file you just chose. The image can be uncompressed, .ZIP or .7Z From there, you can simply hit ENTER to send the command to load MAME, using machine GENESIS, mounting that CARTRIDGE that you set a path for. MAME will start with that configuration. That should be it. If you want to change games, you can by using the TAB menu and choosing File Manager and navigate to where your other games might be.

Hope that helps!

hhisc29926
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:51 am

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:01 pm

Hello, thank you so much for your help!. I am getting somewhere now, that is good, but this is just the beginning. If everything was explained like that on the websites about M.A.M.E., everything would be much easier for everyone.

Thank you for not "getting too deep on softlists and hash files and all that", otherwise I would have understood nothing. Yes, I am familiar (somehow) with the command window and D.O.S. (the first operating system I have ever used, back in 1986...), that is why many things about M.A.M.E. and M.E.S.S. configurations seemed to me like D.O.S., but then: if we are in the Windows era, why do we have to do things in D.O.S.? (I do not understand that). Thank you for the "SHIFT+Right Click" tip, I never, ever in my whole life knew that (until now). I am using two laptop computers, one with Windows 7 and the other with Windows 8.1 (I also have a desktop with Windows XP, but do not consider appropriate to run M.A.M.E. or M.E.S.S. on that old computer). So, I typed "mame64 genesis -cart " (note that there is a blank space after "-cart"), and instead of typing "path/to/game/to/play.now" (silly, but I am mentioning it for the sake of clarity) I dragged the folder where I have the games (it is the "roms" folder inside the MAME folder, as it comes "from factory"), and that dragging to the command window was something totally new for me, too (so, thank you again). When I drag that folder, the computer puts it inside quotation marks ("I:\blah\blah\blah\roms"), so the whole thing is: mame64 genesis -cart "I:\blah\blah\blah\roms". Should I drag the whole folder that has the games, or the particular game that I want to play? (but I want to play all my N.E.S., Genesis, Game Boy, Nintendo 64, Atari, and other games with M.A.M.E, as it is able to do it). After mame64 genesis -cart "I:\blah\blah\blah\roms" I press Enter, and after a few seconds wait, I see two very quick messages when the computer loads M.A.M.E.: "Loading complete" and "Initializing...", then M.A.M.E. crashes, and back at the command window I see "Fatal error: Device Mega Drive Cartridge Slot load <> failed: File not found" (without the quotes).

I have another question, which I had from the very beginning, but did not want to make my request too long when I posted it: Do my games need to have a special format to be run by M.A.M.E. or M.E.S.S.? (I do not think that being just ".zip" files is enough, as anyone can zip any file and put it there, but that does not mean that M.A.M.E. or M.E.S.S. will run it). Well, I guess (but am not sure) that all the files must be ".zip", but what should be in the ".zip" file, does it have to be something special? (my games have extensions ".nes", ".smc", ".bin", ".cue", ".cdi", ".sfc", ".gb", ".gba", ".sg", and others; do I need different files, or are those good enough, as I can play them with console emulators?).

I could not do the last part, because after dragging and clicking Enter you know what happened. But I am beginning to understand, and hopefully these explanations will be good to many frustrated people that have not been able to use M.A.M.E. because of the lack of easy-to-understand documentation.

Again, thank you so very, very much for your invaluable help.

mhoes
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:26 pm

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:58 pm

hhisc29926 wrote:
Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:01 pm
Should I drag the whole folder that has the games, or the particular game that I want to play?
Yes, when you do it this way, you need to 'drag' the exact game you want to play. If you want to play another, you can just drag another game.

Also: Perhaps you are better off with a (easy, limited) GUI so you can just start that and then click on the game to play it. Can anyone here recommend a good/simple GUI for the MESS part ? I only know of MESSUI, but that appears to be tightly tied to an exact MAME version, so that may not be the simplest solution here. And I don't know if QMC2 supports the MESS part, but even if it does that may also not be the best option here (far too many options to configure for the newbie I think).

mhoes
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:26 pm

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:04 pm

hhisc29926 wrote:
Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:01 pm
I have another question, which I had from the very beginning, but did not want to make my request too long when I posted it: Do my games need to have a special format to be run by M.A.M.E. or M.E.S.S.? (I do not think that being just ".zip" files is enough, as anyone can zip any file and put it there, but that does not mean that M.A.M.E. or M.E.S.S. will run it). Well, I guess (but am not sure) that all the files must be ".zip", but what should be in the ".zip" file, does it have to be something special? (my games have extensions ".nes", ".smc", ".bin", ".cue", ".cdi", ".sfc", ".gb", ".gba", ".sg", and others; do I need different files, or are those good enough, as I can play them with console emulators?).
Yes, they need to be in either a zip file (or '7-Zip'), or unzipped in a subdirectory with the same name as the zip (but I don't recommend unzipping). What is in the zip file is indeed 'special', as it is tightly coupled with what game/machine it is for and what MAME (therefore) expects to be in that zipfile.

hhisc29926
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:51 am

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm

Hello!. I am advancing!. Finally I could run some games, after a big and long effort, trying different ways, testing different things..., and I have finally been able to run the game "Pier Solar and the Great Architects ", that is the one that originated this whole situation (as far as I have read, it can only be played with M.E.S.S./M.A.M.E.). I am very happy and owe everything to such good advise and explanations. Thank you so very, very much!.

Because I could not run any Sega Genesis games at the beginning, I decided to try "Final Fantasy 1" for the N.E.S., so I typed "mame64 genesis -cart " in the command window, as I had been doing before, dragged the N.E.S. ".zip" file there and pressed Enter, of course that would never work (D'oh!). Then after considerable thinking and meditating on the situation, and more tries, I discovered the mistake: "mame64 genesis -cart " for Nintendo games (and I almost typed a question about that here, but I know I have to do my work and try as much as I can). If there was a Nobel prize for video/computer gaming, then I deserve it!. Then I typed "mame64 nintendo -cart " and dragged the N.E.S. ".zip" file there; after pressing Enter the commad window showed me: " Unknown system 'nintendo' ", followed by a list of (probably) games and systems, like N.E.S. (nes) and S.N.E.S. (snes). So, after choosing the right console/system name I could run some games. How can I find the name of the systems that M.A.M.E. can emulate, and the names that M.A.M.E. gives to them?.

I zipped files (games) that run perfectly on emulators (with extensions such as ".nes", ".smc", ".bin", ".cue", ".cdi", ".sfc", ".gb", ".gba", ".sg", and others), then used them with M.A.M.E. and some of them work, because I have been unsuccessful with all the S.N.E.S. games that I have tried (which run perfectly on emulators); why is that happening?. I keep receiving the message

"spc700.rom NOT FOUND <tried in snes snes>
Fatal error: Required files are missing, the machine cannot be run."

at the command window.

I finally understood what the "TAB menu" is (once in the game, press the "Tab" key), and finally found the "File Manager" (that I knew existed, because I have seen snapshots of it, just did not know where it was). I can change games of the same console through the File Manager, but if I choose a game of a different console (for example, changing from a N.E.S. game to a Genesis game), M.A.M.E. crashes and I get the message: "Fatal error: Device NES Cartridge Slot load failed: Unspecified error" at the command window.

The quality of the image for the console games I have used with M.A.M.E. is not as good as that of the emulators, is there any way to make it better? (for example, the color is faded).

Does M.A.M.E. accept ".rar" files, or any other type of compressed files, or do they have to be only ".zip"? (and even more: does M.A.M.E. accept only compressed files?).

And finally: Do I always have to use the command window to run console games with M.A.M.E.?, why can I not see any console games (even the ones that I have already used with M.A.M.E.) when I click on "mame64" and start M.A.M.E.? (when I click on "Available" I can only see the arcade games). Oh, the last one: Does M.E.S.S. work in the same way as M.A.M.E., regarding console games (or: Can I apply those same explanations/instructions to M.E.S.S.?)?.

Again, I really thank you all for so much help, I have learnt a lot from you. So much interest in helping makes anyone feel great, thank you!.

mhoes
Posts: 46
Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:26 pm

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Fri Aug 04, 2017 11:59 am

hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
I zipped files (games) that run perfectly on emulators (with extensions such as ".nes", ".smc", ".bin", ".cue", ".cdi", ".sfc", ".gb", ".gba", ".sg", and others), then used them with M.A.M.E. and some of them work, because I have been unsuccessful with all the S.N.E.S. games that I have tried (which run perfectly on emulators); why is that happening?. I keep receiving the message

"spc700.rom NOT FOUND <tried in snes snes>
Fatal error: Required files are missing, the machine cannot be run."

at the command window.
What is in the zip file is tightly coupled with what game/machine it is for and what MAME (therefore) expects to be in that zipfile. In other words: You cannot simply put things in the zip and automagically expect MAME to run it: There has to be support for what is in the zip in the MAME emulator code. The only reason it *could* work is, when both MAME and another emulator have support for the exact same machine/game in the emulator code *and* the contents of the zip file are exactly identical, but I expect this to be a rare case. In your specific case above, MAME expects the specific file 'spc700.rom' with specific contents to be in the zip, and your zip file is missing that file or it's contents are not exactly identical to what MAME expects and needs.
hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
I finally understood what the "TAB menu" is (once in the game, press the "Tab" key), and finally found the "File Manager" (that I knew existed, because I have seen snapshots of it, just did not know where it was). I can change games of the same console through the File Manager, but if I choose a game of a different console (for example, changing from a N.E.S. game to a Genesis game), M.A.M.E. crashes and I get the message: "Fatal error: Device NES Cartridge Slot load failed: Unspecified error" at the command window.
Not sure what is happening here. I assume it's because once you have selected a machine from the commandline, MAME expects the next game to be from that same machine. If this is the case, that may be intended behavior or a bug. Anyway, I'm sure someone else can provide a better answer here.
hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
The quality of the image for the console games I have used with M.A.M.E. is not as good as that of the emulators, is there any way to make it better? (for example, the color is faded).
Again, not sure what's going on, but I expect it is one of the following: MAME allows for a lot of graphical 'effects', for example an effect that makes a modern day LCD screen look like an old CRT monitor. You can look up the details for those options in the MAME documentation. Apart from that, one of the differences between MAME and some other emulators, is that MAME is primarily and specifically about 'precision' and 'accuracy' of emulation (and 'preservation'). Which means for example that if the actual hardware it emulates was slow, the emulation will be slow too. Were the graphics low-res on the original hardware, or was the sound awful due to hardware restrictions on the original hardware, it will be the same in MAME. Some other emulators choose a different path, and instead, make the game run faster/smoother higher-res etc. than the original hardware did. This is a conscious decision made by the MAME developers, because they want the emulation to be as near to 100% exactly the same as possible to the original.
hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
Does M.A.M.E. accept ".rar" files, or any other type of compressed files, or do they have to be only ".zip"? (and even more: does M.A.M.E. accept only compressed files?).
Yes, they need to be in either a zip file (or '7-Zip'), or unzipped in a subdirectory with the exact same name as the zip (but I don't recommend unzipping !). Other compression types like Rar are not supported as far as I know.
hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
And finally: Do I always have to use the command window to run console games with M.A.M.E.?, why can I not see any console games (even the ones that I have already used with M.A.M.E.) when I click on "mame64" and start M.A.M.E.? (when I click on "Available" I can only see the arcade games).
I always wondered about that myself, but never cared enough to investigate. Perhaps someone else can help you here.
hhisc29926 wrote:
Thu Aug 03, 2017 9:40 pm
Oh, the last one: Does M.E.S.S. work in the same way as M.A.M.E., regarding console games (or: Can I apply those same explanations/instructions to M.E.S.S.?)?.
Yes, I assume you can.

hhisc29926
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:51 am

Re: I need basic help with MAME - NES - Genesis, thank you.

Fri Aug 04, 2017 9:13 pm

Hello, thank you for so much help!. Thanks to such good explanations (which sadly can not be found on the internet, or at least not with that clarity) I have accomplished the main objectives/goals of my post: to be able to play "Pier Solar and the Great Architects", and to learn some of the basic things to run console games on M.A.M.E. (and probably also on M.E.S.S.). Because I have asked lots of questions at different times, and some are still unanswered, I am summarizing them here, so that they will not be scattered and forgotten:

--- I have read that none of the latest versions of M.E.S.S. or M.A.M.E. need B.I.O.S. for N.E.S. nor Genesis, but they probably need B.I.O.S. for other consoles/systems, as I solved my problem:

"spc700.rom NOT FOUND <tried in snes snes>
Fatal error: Required files are missing, the machine cannot be run."

by downloading the B.I.O.S. file for the S.N.E.S., even when the folder that contains the B.I.O.S.es is named "MESS-0.151.BIOS.ROMs" and I am using M.A.M.E. 0.188. I would like to know, if possible, for which consoles/systems M.A.M.E. does not need B.I.O.S. and for which it does (I have not been able to find that anywhere). Every time I get a message of files missing, I instsall the B.I.O.S. for that console/system and solve the problem. I used Google to find that out, as I have never found it in the M.A.M.E. documentation.

--- I have been using unzipped files with M.A.M.E. (with extensions such as ".nes", ".smc", ".bin", ".cue", ".cdi", ".sfc", ".gb", ".gba", ".sg", and others) and they all work (unless I have not placed the B.I.O.S. for that console/system in the "roms" folder of M.A.M.E., but N.E.S. and Genesis do not need B.I.O.S.). I still do not understand why the game files have to be compressed (".zip" or ".7z").

--- I can change games of the same console through the File Manager, but if I choose a game of a different console (for example, changing from a N.E.S. game to a Genesis game), M.A.M.E. crashes and I get the message: "Fatal error: Device NES Cartridge Slot load failed: Unspecified error" at the command window.

--- The quality of the image for the console games I have used with M.A.M.E. is not as good as that of the console emulators (for examples, FCEUX or Kega Fusion), is there any way to make it better? (for example, the color is faded/washed-out, and the worst quality is with the N.E.S. games). I have used the consoles themselves with the television, and the color is much better than that of M.A.M.E., so I do not understand why that happens if one of the main purposes of M.A.M.E. is "accuracy".

--- Do I always have to use the command window to run console games with M.A.M.E.? (if we are in the Windows era, why do we have to do things in D.O.S.?).

--- Why M.A.M.E. manages arcade games and console games so differently?, and I particularly mean: why can I not see any console games (even the ones that I have already used with M.A.M.E.) when I click on "mame64" and start M.A.M.E.? (when I click on "Available" I can only see the arcade games).


--- (This is not a question). I finally found something I needed: the list of M.E.S.S. supported systems with the names that M.E.S.S. gives to them (I assume it is the same for M.A.M.E.). In the case someone needs it: "https://www.mess.org/supported_systems". I recommend to save it (for example, in an MS Word document) and put it close to the M.E.S.S./M.A.M.E. folder for future reference.

And this is an unimportant question:

--- When I type mame64 nes -cart and drag the game file there, why does the path to the game have to be inside quotaion marks? (can it be without the quotation marks?).

Thank you all for your interest and help!.

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